Did you find one?lavron wrote: definitely will go diaphragm PP
See Ya,
Mike
T-5 Questions & Info
Re: T-5 Question
Yespoboyjo65 wrote:Did you find one?
See Ya,
Mike
Re: T-5 Question
I am putting a copy of my T5 update here where it makes more sense than my build thread because the info could be useful to anyone building a Comet from any year or configuration, so if you have seen this info in my build thread this is the same;
Not that the internet is lacking this information, but Comet Performance Forum is so I thought I would post a few pictures of the conversion of the '98 V6 T5 to mimic a '86 V8 T5, you might wonder why someone would do this? I have a couple of reasons, first nobody makes an adapter for the later model T5s with the long input shaft (all later T5s had them V8s as well) so it is easier to convert the transmission than try to come up with or make an adapter, second I got the T5 cheap (let's think in the $100 range) and I wanted the gearing a V6 has, plus I was hoping that maybe a V6 transmission saw a more gentle life than a V8 one. If you saw my post earlier on the inspection of this T5 it is in very good condition, no chipped or worn teeth and everything is tight.
I applaud all those people who can take pictures or make videos when they are working on something, I really suck at it and remember to take a picture after I already got something together, but I will try to explain what I did and supplement with the pictures I did get.
First here is the difference in the 2 input shafts, they are the same except, as you can see the V6 one is quite a bit longer.
Now I dismantled my transmission more than is required to just change the input shaft because I wanted to inspect it before I spent the money on a new shaft, if you are changing just your shaft, drain your transmission and remove the 4 bolts that hold the bearing retainer to the case, you will be changing the retainer as well (at least I did) because the old one will be too long, you can cut the old one if you want but I wanted the solid iron retainer instead of the steel and aluminum retainer, I suggest you tilt your transmission forward, and then I used a rubber mallet and tapped on the side of the retainer out towards the end to break the seal loose. When it breaks loose, push in on the shaft and slide the retainer forward removing it. Now you need to rotate the shaft until a cutout on the rear synchro gear aligns with the front gear on the counter shaft (it is a 1/4 moon shaped part missing on the input shaft rear most gear) carefully slide the shaft out of the transmission and watch for the thrust bearing, thrust washer, spacer and the front synchro ring that they don't fall off. The kit I got came with a new thrust bearing and washer (race) but not the spacer ring or the synchro ring.
Make sure when you get the input shaft out that you have all 15 of the needle bearings inside of it, I just dumped them out into my hand and counted them.
You don't want any of those left behind in your transmission. The kit I got came with new needle bearings as well, so I used some transmission assembly grease and installed them in the input shaft pocket as well as the thrust bearing (I put the thrust race in as well but did not do so until after I took the picture)
The other thing I did was install the new front seal in the new bearing retainer, this is how it goes with the cupped side facing in.
At this point I put the new shaft in the transmission, I had kept everything tilted forward, and installed the new front bearing race and the retainer and snugged the bolts up, I did not put the preload spacer/s in yet because I need to reassemble the rest of the transmission cases.
I had already done this; but if you want to remove the top cover of the transmission you have to remove the tailshaft housing first. The way you remove them is like so; (sorry no pictures) 1. Remove the shifter if you have one (put the transmission in neutral first) it is held on by 4 bolts and sealer, don't pry it off (or any part of the transmission) but gently tap it too one side with a mallet till it breaks free well enough to remove it. there is a plastic cup that the shifter shaft ball sits in, don't loose it (I replaced mine anyway for wear) 2. Inside the transmission you will see the shifter block with a rod running out of it towards the main body of the transmission, a roll pin holds it in place, make sure you are in neutral and drive the pin down until it clears the block. 3. remove the bolts that hold the rear housing onto the main body, additionally remove the speedo driven gear (if you have the electronic unit on the side) it is held in with one bolt just like a cable (you install the cable there instead of the electronic unit later) to get the housing to break free I use my rubber mallet (it is actually a hard rubber dead blow hammer) and tap on the housing side near the very back or the side of the shifter housing, the tailshaft housing should break free, then I used one hand to hold over the shifter block as I slid the housing back with my other hand, the block will come off and it is spring loaded with a ball bearing underneath, you don't want to lose those, as soon as the block is free of the shifter shaft I stop and remove the block, ball, spring and the roll pin, then I slide the housing the rest of the way off, I have seen warnings about loosing the oil slinger off of the back of the 5th gear cluster but I didn't have one or it was firmly attached to the gear set.
The top cover simply unbolts and use the mallet again to tap on the left side (there is a little raised spot there) until it breaks free, then you sort of slide it to the right and up and it will lift the shift forks off the synchro gears(?).
Next I switched out my Speedometer drive gear for a 6 tooth gear (the black gear), you do that by squeezing the tab down on the rear of the gear and sliding the gear back until it clears the clip, it might take a little tapping with a mallet to get it started. A couple of notes; Don't break the clip or let it fly out of there and loose it, the manual also shows a "C" clip behind the gear (rearward) that needs removed, mine didn't have this clip or a slot machined for one, I did have a rubber seal on the shaft toward the rear that is not in the book nor can I find any pictures of it on the internet.
I slid my new gear up on the shaft and clipped it in place.
Next I cleaned all of my mounting surfaces with a razor blade and a scotchbrite pad and wiped them down with acetone. On the shift forks I put a little prelube on the slider blocks.
And I applied "The Right Stuff" sealer to the top of the transmission and let it set for a minute.
Then realign your forks on your sliders and place the cover back down moving from the right to left as you go down, replace the bolts (note two shoulder bolts, they go caddy corner from each other and really will only fit in those two places) torque the bolts down to 10 ft.lbs. (truthfully this made me nervous so I went to 8 ft. lbs.)
I cleaned the rear of the housing and the tailshaft housing the same as the top cover.
I applied sealer in the same way circling the bolt holes. Now the fun begins of putting the the housing on while trying to hold the shifter parts all together, I thought it was easier to pull the shift rod back to 4th gear and slide the block on until the pin hole lined back up, I push my drift punch into the hole and shift it back into neutral then. NOTE; If the housing will not seat it could be that same oil slinger on the 5th gear cluster, if you look in back of the case where that goes it has a notch it sits in, just rotate to match before you try to put the housing on, don't force it, I have seen recommendations to use a hammer to tap the housing in place, I wouldn't, it should slide on fairly easy.
Tap the pin back into the hole to hold the shift block on the shaft.
I used blue thread locker on my bolts and reinstalled them and torqued them down to 23 ft. lbs. in sort of a star pattern.
I installed my new plastic bushing in the shifter block and coated it with assembly lube to keep it in there.
You can see the drive pin in this picture as well.
At this point I set my transmission up so the input shaft was facing up, as you can see in the pictures, my bench is a couple of sawhorses with two scraps of 3/4" OSB across them, this "clever"
design allowed me to put the tailshaft between the two pieces of OSB and it stood on the rear transmission mounts. I removed the front bearing retainer bolts and slid the retainer off, now there is a way to measure all of this to determine what preload shims to use, but I am not smart enough to figure it out, to make a long process short what I ended up doing is using the shim from the old shaft (I got a set shims with the kit) basically you are looking for the retainer to set down flush on the main case and then when bolted down you can't move the shaft up and down but the transmission is not binding either. Once you get the proper preload, remove the retainer and put sealer around the hole and the bolt holes, like earlier, I used the blue thread locker again and torqued the bolts down to 15 ft. lbs.
Lastly I installed my new short throw shifter by putting sealer around the case edge and putting the shifter in place and installing the new bolts supplied with it.
There it is the converted T5 transmission.
I still need to get a new rear seal because I removed the old one while the housing was off, and of course no one in town had any I will order one.
Not quite sure how to set up the rest of the shifter but will do that later, it didn't have instructions but I am sure there are some out on the interwebs I still need to get some ATF for it and was thinking about synthetic maybe.
Maybe this will be interesting to someone.
See Ya,
Mike
Not that the internet is lacking this information, but Comet Performance Forum is so I thought I would post a few pictures of the conversion of the '98 V6 T5 to mimic a '86 V8 T5, you might wonder why someone would do this? I have a couple of reasons, first nobody makes an adapter for the later model T5s with the long input shaft (all later T5s had them V8s as well) so it is easier to convert the transmission than try to come up with or make an adapter, second I got the T5 cheap (let's think in the $100 range) and I wanted the gearing a V6 has, plus I was hoping that maybe a V6 transmission saw a more gentle life than a V8 one. If you saw my post earlier on the inspection of this T5 it is in very good condition, no chipped or worn teeth and everything is tight.
I applaud all those people who can take pictures or make videos when they are working on something, I really suck at it and remember to take a picture after I already got something together, but I will try to explain what I did and supplement with the pictures I did get.
First here is the difference in the 2 input shafts, they are the same except, as you can see the V6 one is quite a bit longer.
Now I dismantled my transmission more than is required to just change the input shaft because I wanted to inspect it before I spent the money on a new shaft, if you are changing just your shaft, drain your transmission and remove the 4 bolts that hold the bearing retainer to the case, you will be changing the retainer as well (at least I did) because the old one will be too long, you can cut the old one if you want but I wanted the solid iron retainer instead of the steel and aluminum retainer, I suggest you tilt your transmission forward, and then I used a rubber mallet and tapped on the side of the retainer out towards the end to break the seal loose. When it breaks loose, push in on the shaft and slide the retainer forward removing it. Now you need to rotate the shaft until a cutout on the rear synchro gear aligns with the front gear on the counter shaft (it is a 1/4 moon shaped part missing on the input shaft rear most gear) carefully slide the shaft out of the transmission and watch for the thrust bearing, thrust washer, spacer and the front synchro ring that they don't fall off. The kit I got came with a new thrust bearing and washer (race) but not the spacer ring or the synchro ring.
Make sure when you get the input shaft out that you have all 15 of the needle bearings inside of it, I just dumped them out into my hand and counted them.
You don't want any of those left behind in your transmission. The kit I got came with new needle bearings as well, so I used some transmission assembly grease and installed them in the input shaft pocket as well as the thrust bearing (I put the thrust race in as well but did not do so until after I took the picture)
The other thing I did was install the new front seal in the new bearing retainer, this is how it goes with the cupped side facing in.
At this point I put the new shaft in the transmission, I had kept everything tilted forward, and installed the new front bearing race and the retainer and snugged the bolts up, I did not put the preload spacer/s in yet because I need to reassemble the rest of the transmission cases.
I had already done this; but if you want to remove the top cover of the transmission you have to remove the tailshaft housing first. The way you remove them is like so; (sorry no pictures) 1. Remove the shifter if you have one (put the transmission in neutral first) it is held on by 4 bolts and sealer, don't pry it off (or any part of the transmission) but gently tap it too one side with a mallet till it breaks free well enough to remove it. there is a plastic cup that the shifter shaft ball sits in, don't loose it (I replaced mine anyway for wear) 2. Inside the transmission you will see the shifter block with a rod running out of it towards the main body of the transmission, a roll pin holds it in place, make sure you are in neutral and drive the pin down until it clears the block. 3. remove the bolts that hold the rear housing onto the main body, additionally remove the speedo driven gear (if you have the electronic unit on the side) it is held in with one bolt just like a cable (you install the cable there instead of the electronic unit later) to get the housing to break free I use my rubber mallet (it is actually a hard rubber dead blow hammer) and tap on the housing side near the very back or the side of the shifter housing, the tailshaft housing should break free, then I used one hand to hold over the shifter block as I slid the housing back with my other hand, the block will come off and it is spring loaded with a ball bearing underneath, you don't want to lose those, as soon as the block is free of the shifter shaft I stop and remove the block, ball, spring and the roll pin, then I slide the housing the rest of the way off, I have seen warnings about loosing the oil slinger off of the back of the 5th gear cluster but I didn't have one or it was firmly attached to the gear set.
The top cover simply unbolts and use the mallet again to tap on the left side (there is a little raised spot there) until it breaks free, then you sort of slide it to the right and up and it will lift the shift forks off the synchro gears(?).
Next I switched out my Speedometer drive gear for a 6 tooth gear (the black gear), you do that by squeezing the tab down on the rear of the gear and sliding the gear back until it clears the clip, it might take a little tapping with a mallet to get it started. A couple of notes; Don't break the clip or let it fly out of there and loose it, the manual also shows a "C" clip behind the gear (rearward) that needs removed, mine didn't have this clip or a slot machined for one, I did have a rubber seal on the shaft toward the rear that is not in the book nor can I find any pictures of it on the internet.
I slid my new gear up on the shaft and clipped it in place.
Next I cleaned all of my mounting surfaces with a razor blade and a scotchbrite pad and wiped them down with acetone. On the shift forks I put a little prelube on the slider blocks.
And I applied "The Right Stuff" sealer to the top of the transmission and let it set for a minute.
Then realign your forks on your sliders and place the cover back down moving from the right to left as you go down, replace the bolts (note two shoulder bolts, they go caddy corner from each other and really will only fit in those two places) torque the bolts down to 10 ft.lbs. (truthfully this made me nervous so I went to 8 ft. lbs.)
I cleaned the rear of the housing and the tailshaft housing the same as the top cover.
I applied sealer in the same way circling the bolt holes. Now the fun begins of putting the the housing on while trying to hold the shifter parts all together, I thought it was easier to pull the shift rod back to 4th gear and slide the block on until the pin hole lined back up, I push my drift punch into the hole and shift it back into neutral then. NOTE; If the housing will not seat it could be that same oil slinger on the 5th gear cluster, if you look in back of the case where that goes it has a notch it sits in, just rotate to match before you try to put the housing on, don't force it, I have seen recommendations to use a hammer to tap the housing in place, I wouldn't, it should slide on fairly easy.
Tap the pin back into the hole to hold the shift block on the shaft.
I used blue thread locker on my bolts and reinstalled them and torqued them down to 23 ft. lbs. in sort of a star pattern.
I installed my new plastic bushing in the shifter block and coated it with assembly lube to keep it in there.
You can see the drive pin in this picture as well.
At this point I set my transmission up so the input shaft was facing up, as you can see in the pictures, my bench is a couple of sawhorses with two scraps of 3/4" OSB across them, this "clever"
design allowed me to put the tailshaft between the two pieces of OSB and it stood on the rear transmission mounts. I removed the front bearing retainer bolts and slid the retainer off, now there is a way to measure all of this to determine what preload shims to use, but I am not smart enough to figure it out, to make a long process short what I ended up doing is using the shim from the old shaft (I got a set shims with the kit) basically you are looking for the retainer to set down flush on the main case and then when bolted down you can't move the shaft up and down but the transmission is not binding either. Once you get the proper preload, remove the retainer and put sealer around the hole and the bolt holes, like earlier, I used the blue thread locker again and torqued the bolts down to 15 ft. lbs.Lastly I installed my new short throw shifter by putting sealer around the case edge and putting the shifter in place and installing the new bolts supplied with it.
There it is the converted T5 transmission.
I still need to get a new rear seal because I removed the old one while the housing was off, and of course no one in town had any
I will order one.Not quite sure how to set up the rest of the shifter but will do that later, it didn't have instructions but I am sure there are some out on the interwebs
I still need to get some ATF for it and was thinking about synthetic maybe.Maybe this will be interesting to someone.
See Ya,
Mike
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
I was not sure air I ever said why I went with the 6 tooth speedometer gear, so if I repeat myself, shoot ugly looks my way
In all the questions I have been posing on the final drive ratios I went out and checked on what I would need to get my speedo registering at least close. You have a choice between 3 drive gears in the T5, 6, 7 & 8 tooth, mine was the green gear, 8 tooth, to get the right gearing I would need like a 24 tooth gear, which from what I read would not last very long because of the teeth being so thin, so I checked what the 7 tooth gear would do for me and the 6 tooth. I don't remember what the combo was in the 7 tooth but 6 tooth matched to a 17 tooth driven gear which was a much "meatier" gear so I chose that one.
I believe the 6 tooth gears were never offered in a factory car, but I could be wrong, they are good if you have a 3.73 or lower rear gear set.
I got them from here and they are genuine Ford parts; https://lmr.com
See Ya,
Mike
In all the questions I have been posing on the final drive ratios I went out and checked on what I would need to get my speedo registering at least close. You have a choice between 3 drive gears in the T5, 6, 7 & 8 tooth, mine was the green gear, 8 tooth, to get the right gearing I would need like a 24 tooth gear, which from what I read would not last very long because of the teeth being so thin, so I checked what the 7 tooth gear would do for me and the 6 tooth. I don't remember what the combo was in the 7 tooth but 6 tooth matched to a 17 tooth driven gear which was a much "meatier" gear so I chose that one.
I believe the 6 tooth gears were never offered in a factory car, but I could be wrong, they are good if you have a 3.73 or lower rear gear set.
I got them from here and they are genuine Ford parts; https://lmr.com
See Ya,
Mike
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
I was looking at Pilot Bushing/bearings for my car, I have a choice, it appears of either a roller bearing or a solid bushing, which do you guys think is the better choice?
See Ya,
Mike
See Ya,
Mike
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
been a roller in my comet for over 20yrs,,can't say if one is better or not,the tranny has not been out for yrs....lavron wrote:I was looking at Pilot Bushing/bearings for my car, I have a choice, it appears of either a roller bearing or a solid bushing, which do you guys think is the better choice?
See Ya,
Mike
pop/glenda
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redhotcomet
- Posts: 349
- Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:22 pm
- Location: Saskatchewan, Canada
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
Roller bearing here. I think either will work fine.
1964 Caliente hardtop, 302/T5/8.8"
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Comechero65
- Posts: 1870
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 10:37 pm
- Location: Santa Clara, Ca
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
I prefer the roller bearing as I feel it will outlast a bushing. I have used the ford roller bearing as well as a common bearing from the local bearing supply hoise.
Ron
Ron
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
I thought roller bearing as well but thought I would check with everyone and see what they preferred or any known issue.
Thanks for the input guys.
See Ya,
Mike
Thanks for the input guys.
See Ya,
Mike
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
Last of my T5 conversion until install , it is finished, I installed the rear seal today.
I slathered it generously with transmission assembly lube to help lubricate it and keep the springs in place.
I applied a bead of Right Stuff Sealer around the outside just to be sure I would have no leaks (I hope).
And then I installed it. I found out a 2" PVC pipe makes a good seal driver for installing this, it is just the right size, here it is installed.
Now the T5 is ready and waiting for installation. I do have the mount I need to clean up but that is all I will be doing with it until I order the adapter and get my bell, then I will test how everything fits together.
BTW I found a diaphragm pressure plate and clutch that includes the pilot roller bearing and a TO bearing fairly cheap.
See Ya,
Mike
, it is finished, I installed the rear seal today.I slathered it generously with transmission assembly lube to help lubricate it and keep the springs in place.
I applied a bead of Right Stuff Sealer around the outside just to be sure I would have no leaks (I hope).
And then I installed it. I found out a 2" PVC pipe makes a good seal driver for installing this, it is just the right size, here it is installed.
Now the T5 is ready and waiting for installation. I do have the mount I need to clean up but that is all I will be doing with it until I order the adapter and get my bell, then I will test how everything fits together.
BTW I found a diaphragm pressure plate and clutch that includes the pilot roller bearing and a TO bearing fairly cheap.
See Ya,
Mike
-
Jims65cyclone
- Posts: 2764
- Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:29 pm
- Location: Lexington, SC
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
Source?lavron wrote: BTW I found a diaphragm pressure plate and clutch that includes the pilot roller bearing and a TO bearing fairly cheap.
Jim
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
eBay has a ton of them, probably not the best quality, and I will jump back and forth before I finally buy one probably.Jims65cyclone wrote:Source?
Here is one for $75 that will fit my car, I had found one even cheaper but the auction ended or somebody bought it
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Alto-Standard-9 ... aa&vxp=mtr
If I was building a stouter car I would go with one from someplace like Summit, for my little car an '80s Mustang or Fairmont stock one will probably suffice I won't be doing any hard launches or anything, but I also don't want one I have to change any time soon.
See Ya,
Mike
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
Rock Auto had cheap clutch packages as well, again not performance stuff.
A question about the rear mount on a T5, I cleaned up the one that came with the transmission (of course no crossmember) but everything was in pieces. I Googled around and found a picture of an aftermarket mount so I am pretty sure that I got the two parts figured out as well as some odd bolts that came along with the transmission.
The thing it I have a lever/bar attached to the rear of the upper mount and a rubber isolator, I am assuming the isolator is an exhaust mount but have no idea what the bar is, it is just attached with one bolt and will move from side to side. I also have 3 bolts left over, two have tin brackets on them and have no idea what they are for, you can see everything in the attached picture.
My guess is there is only one isolator because it was a single exhaust car and there would be two for a dual exhaust car, you can also see the markings in the paint where the bolts attach and the impression of the transmission mounting pad.
The loose bolts are in the upper picture.
See Ya,
Mike
A question about the rear mount on a T5, I cleaned up the one that came with the transmission (of course no crossmember) but everything was in pieces. I Googled around and found a picture of an aftermarket mount so I am pretty sure that I got the two parts figured out as well as some odd bolts that came along with the transmission.
The thing it I have a lever/bar attached to the rear of the upper mount and a rubber isolator, I am assuming the isolator is an exhaust mount but have no idea what the bar is, it is just attached with one bolt and will move from side to side. I also have 3 bolts left over, two have tin brackets on them and have no idea what they are for, you can see everything in the attached picture.
My guess is there is only one isolator because it was a single exhaust car and there would be two for a dual exhaust car, you can also see the markings in the paint where the bolts attach and the impression of the transmission mounting pad.
The loose bolts are in the upper picture.
See Ya,
Mike
Re: T-5 Questions & Info
Those do look like exhaust hangers maybe when they pulled it the other rubber hanger got left on the exhaust.
Ant
Ant
