Brake Drum Question

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Brake Drum Question

Postby Groover » Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:36 pm

So I'm 35,000 miles in and my front brakes now squeal all the time (well at least when braking).

Changed the shoes... got better for a few days, then back to squealing
Machined the drums... got better for a few days, then back to squealing
Rotated the drums (crossed them over L to R)... got better for a few days, then back to squealing

I know one of the drums has a hairline surface crack in it (shop showed it to me after machining them).

Question:

Should I just buy a new set of drums from some/any ole supplier...
or
are brake drums similar to other parts where (channeling my inner Roy Pool) "the new stuff is all crap, you need to get some from back when they were made from real American steel."

Frankly I am kind of hoping one of you has a pile of these in the garage after doing the disc brake swap, but shipping may be just as expensive as buying them new.

Thoughts?
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby poboyjo65 » Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:53 pm

Maybe the shoes? I have a drum if you want it.

Has either one ever got fluid on it?

you might try scuffing the shoes with sandpapper, use to do that on bikes.
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby Groover » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:09 pm

I scuff the shoes every time I go in there (and these are new shoes).

I'm sure somewhere in their life the drums may have had fluid on them, but not since they were recently machined.
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby Lou's Comet » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:36 pm

Try bevelling the leading and trailing edges of the shoes.

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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby lavron » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:56 pm

I will just throw this in here, because I can't remember, but are the shoes the same, in is there a front and rear shoe and could they be on backwards? I know some rears are that way but not sure on front ones :roll:

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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby Groover » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:59 pm

lavron wrote:I will just throw this in here, because I can't remember, but are the shoes the same, in is there a front and rear shoe and could they be on backwards? I know some rears are that way but not sure on front ones :roll:

See Ya,
Mike


They are different, and I have them on correctly.
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby poboyjo65 » Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:20 pm

Lou's Comet wrote:Try bevelling the leading and trailing edges of the shoes.
Lou

I like Lou's idea.
On a bike with duel front disc it would squeal sometimes so I'd rub a bar of soap on both sides of each disc just a little. But I can t remember was probably just a temp fix.
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby comethead » Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:45 am

Could it be the type of shoe your using? Is it semi metallic? Maybe another type of material would help.

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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby Groover » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:49 pm

I'm not sure about the composition of the shoes. I got them at NAPA. I can check that.

All of the responses so far lean toward the shoes.

Does that mean nobody thinks the drums are of concern at this point?

Or just that it's easier to work on the shoes first?
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby poboyjo65 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 4:16 pm

Groover wrote:
Does that mean nobody thinks the drums are of concern at this point?


Well the crack is a concern. when you say hairline crack,is it visible from both sides? either way a crack is a crack. it aint coming back, it can only grow, it cant shrink. If you want to stop by on your way to pf I'll give you a drum. I'm not too far out of your way. But if I come to pf I can bring it.

Did you break in the shoes?
http://brakerate.wagnerbrake.com/tech-tips/break-in
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby Lou's Comet » Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:48 pm

Groover wrote:I'm not sure about the composition of the shoes. I got them at NAPA. I can check that.

All of the responses so far lean toward the shoes.

Does that mean nobody thinks the drums are of concern at this point?

Or just that it's easier to work on the shoes first?


I don't think it is the drums. Plus I would try fixing the shoes first, cheapest and easier!

Are your shoes like this, with the leading and trailing edges square/90%?

Image

Or are they like this with beveled edges?

Image

If they are like the first photo with square edges, I would bevel them like the shoes in the second photo.

You are scuffing them every time you take them apart? You may be softening the edges when you scuff them. And that may be the reason the noise goes away for a little while but comes back. If you bevel them the noise should go away and not come back..

I would give it a try. Worked for me many times, actually bevel all pads/shoes now if they don't come that way. Really don't think it is the drums

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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby Kingspeedy2 » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:15 am

next time you have the drums and shoes off ,Put the shoes in the Drum and check the contact.Its possible the shoes are the wrong diameter ,which usually manifests with a rub pint at the tangent or the corners of the shoes. .Just on more thing to eliminate
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby Groover » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:17 am

Thanks Lou, I'm pretty sure they are NOT beveled like that, so i can do that (easy and cheap). :)

And it would be great if it's not the drums, so I'm all about that too. I was just running out of things to try with the shoes, but now I have a new trick to try from my tool bag.

Thanks to everybody who's been chiming in.

John, the crack in on the inside surface. It was only visible once we machined them clean and level.
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Re: Brake Drum Question (Resolved)

Postby Groover » Tue Mar 13, 2018 5:44 pm

Ok... resolved... and a little embarrassing, but I'm gonna share the answer for the sake of knowledge, and share the fault with my parts store.

I took everything off again this weekend preparing to swap the shoes again (got a new pair that was beveled like Lou showed in the photo). When I got in there, mine were already beveled :( However, on the passenger side, while staring at them to make sure I had the shoe with the greater surface area facing the rear... and at just the right angle I noticed that the rear facing shoe was slightly narrower than the front facing shoe.

The hell?

Measured them, and the rear facing was 2" wide while the front facing was 2.25". How the heck did that happen. Looked at the other side, expecting to see one 2" (front facing) and one 2.25 (rear facing) but they were both 2.25". Only thing I can figure is the last time I bought them, the good folks at NAPA did a mix and match on that box, or somebody had bought both front and rear, mixed them around and then returned the boxes. I don't have any other 2" shoes laying around so I don't see how I could have swapped front shoes with back shoes and I haven't changed rear shoes in a long time. A quarter inch difference is pretty tough to see when they are installed unless you look at the bottom where the adjuster is and the two sides come close together.

On the drum for the 2" side there was a nice line running round the whole interior which I presume is where the edge of the shoe was pressing into the drum every time I hit the brakes.

Thankfully I had a box of old front shoes (I seem to always forget to return the cores) and one of them had plenty of surface left. So I put it on, ruffed them up and closed the whole thing back up. Drove it all day today and it's quiet as a church mouse :)
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Re: Brake Drum Question

Postby lavron » Tue Mar 13, 2018 10:11 pm

Groover wrote:Ok... resolved... and a little embarrassing, but I'm gonna share the answer for the sake of knowledge


Thanks, and this is all information we can use, or at least to look smarter if anyone else has the same problem and asks us. :roll:

Glad you got it sorted.

See Ya,
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