Lavron's '64 Build Thread

[lavron]

Will be interesting to see the tri-carb setup run. That should work well with your engine

It will hopefully help it breathe better that is my goal anyway of doing it along with better fuel distribution.

Who says Ford parts don't interchange

Tried to get a piece from every decade (1960s-2000s) in there and every different motor configuration (L4-L6-V6-V8) and they are even playing nice together.

See Ya,
Mike

[Joe Travers]

Tried to get a piece from every decade (1960s-2000s) in there and every different motor configuration (L4-L6-V6-V8) and they are even playing nice together.

Your evil twin would make a great Bow-Tie troll

JT

[popscomet]

Tried to get a piece from every decade (1960s-2000s) in there and every different motor configuration (L4-L6-V6-V8)

JOHNNY CASH, put out a song years ago about bulding a car from so many odd parts..... pop

[lavron]

JOHNNY CASH, put out a song years ago about bulding a car from so many odd parts..... pop

Yes but he stole his parts I paid dearly for mine

See Ya,
Mike

[popscomet]

MIKE....he didn't steal those parts,,,,they were fringe benifits......pop

[lavron]

That's a really cool 6 banger build there, Mike! Was hoping you would wrap her up a little, but that's no biggie. Sounds strong idling for a I6.
Who says Ford parts don't interchange You just proved them wrong. Will be interesting to see the tri-carb setup run. That should work well with your engine

JT

It is very responsive to the throttle, certainly the long valve train will never see high RPMs but that is not it's strong suit as you know I hate to say the 250 has it's share of design flaws, I am not saying I can out engineer Ford (who built the engine for the masses and the time under strict government regulations) the biggest issue that killed power on the 250 was the huge piston shortfall (my pistons were 1/8" down the bore at TDC, the reason for the connecting rod swap) the 250 was not the only motor de-tuned during the gas shortages of the '70s but I think each was done in various ways, while I know some of the things they did to the 250 others could tell you what happened to the V8s during that era and how to introduce a few corrections for better performance, stuff the racer and hot rodder have been doing a long time. The really cool thing is everything I did was basically bolt-on changes and nothing had to be adapted per se.

I am sure you guys will see more of the mods operating on my build as time goes on

See Ya,
Mike

[Joe Travers]

the 250 was not the only motor de-tuned during the gas shortages of the '70s but I think each was done in various ways, while I know some of the things they did to the 250 others could tell you what happened to the V8s during that era and how to introduce a few corrections for better performance, stuff the racer and hot rodder have been doing a long time.

Talking my son through a 400 build now to correct that same problem (excessive deck height). The 200 head was a good move. Have any idea what compression ratio you have now? Sounds a lot stronger than the smog version.

JT

[lavron]

Have any idea what compression ratio you have now?

Not sure, the machinist said someplace in the mid to high 9s we cut the dishes bigger in the tops of the pistons to keep from going too high because I wanted it to run on a common pump gas if we would have left them stock it would have been in the 10s, if I was doing it over I would have had him get California emission pistons and saved myself the expense of having him machine the piston tops but I wasn't thinking when we were selecting pistons ( I ended up with a piston near the spec of the CA piston but it cost me more , live and learn) I think I have 12cc dish and the CA pistons are a 13cc dish.

The Tempo connecting rods were near the perfect length at around an 1/8" longer than the 250 rods (the 86-91 Tempo 2.5L HSC motor was a 250-6 or possibly a high deck 200 with two cylinders lopped off basically, take 4.1L/6 and then that number X 4 and you get 2.73333L or 2.5L probably with good math either way, it was made from the basic Ford I6 and the connecting rods fit a 250 I believe they are even forged units) I did have to use Tempo rod bearings because they changed the shape, the crank journal is the same size (I believe the main bearings might be SBF bearings but did test that one out).

I had suspected the FE pushrods were the same because the rocker arms look near identical to the old 144 adjustable rockers in the solid lifter motors, I even wonder if they interchange but I am not going to experiment now, the problem with the 250 pushrods are they never came with adjustable rockers so all of them are ball & ball rods and the 200 ball and cup pushrods are too short, the FE ones were near the perfect length (fortunately) so I did not have to get custom length pushrods made $$$ and got to buy cheaper stock 390 pushrods $ with adjustable rockers they work fine once I actually got them set correctly (initially I had them too tight and with hydraulic lifters that is not required because, as we know, they are supposed to self adjust. Most of the stuff was found by looking through a bunch of specs and looking at pictures plus getting a little confirmation over at the Ford6 forum. Lifters were all the same on the little sixes as FE motors so I was able to get some better FE lifters and put them in there. It does appear that Ford used many interchangeable parts and why wouldn't they? I think they should have made even more things out of the same parts (and maybe they did, I am no expert on anything) the only original part of that junkyard 250 is the block and crank the replacement parts are almost nothing that was made for a 250 (water pump & oil pump are 250 replacements) I suspect there are some other things like timing gear sets that interchange as well but just went with an early ('69) replacement set because Ford had not started retarding the timing sets as badly as they did in the '70s (the cam also has 4 deg. advance built into it)

I am pretty happy I have had few total goofs on setting this motor up (and that is why I am amazed it runs), it is hard finding too much info on doing this that is why I try and post everything to help anyone that follows along behind me I can tell them what worked for me, it is still their chore to actually find some of the rarer parts but I guess that is part of the challenge

See Ya,
Mike

[lavron]

I actually did some work over the last couple of days and didn't just talk about it, used the stud welder for the first time and learned a thing or two, still mixed on whether I did any good on pulling the body line, that is a tough place to pull out.

This video shows how it worked out for me so far and the mistakes I made

Using the HF Stud Gun & Slide Hammer for the First Time

More to come.

See Ya,
Mike

[Cobraguy]

Mike your figuring it out just fine. That was a good practice dent to play with. I would have just filled that one and been done with it. I would weld in the 1/4" filler rod around the wheel arch before pulling along the body line. If you grab the stud at the head with needle nose vice grips and twist it off they break pretty clean with minimal cratering.

[SASSY]

Mike, Im following along. I bought one from HF years ago for a different project,, a dent on mama's minivan,,, she quit complaining so the box hasn't been opened
Fred

[lavron]

Mike your figuring it out just fine. That was a good practice dent to play with. I would have just filled that one and been done with it.

Thanks, yes it really was so shallow there was no need to pull it but it did pull out some so the filler will be even thinner.

Mike, Im following along. I bought one from HF years ago for a different project,, a dent on mama's minivan,,, she quit complaining so the box hasn't been opened
Fred

Well it did not do good a job pulling the body line, I do not think it is the fault of the tool, I don't think that is exactly what it is designed for and that is a hard spot to move, I think the line is in the body to add strength not just be decorative, a flat spot seems to work fine, it is kinda fun to play with and really helps in those spots you can't get behind to hammer out.

The second video here I am calling part 1 of the rear quarter panel repair and I have part 3 on the phone I did today so hopefully everyone will be able to see it by tomorrow or so, depending on how long it takes me to edit it and get it uploaded, this video took pretty much half a day, I finished the edit this morning and then started it uploading and went out and worked on the Comet, got back in here about 3 pm and it said it had another 8 minutes to go, not sure how they measure time because the 2 hours this morning was a good 4 hours and 8 minutes is like 20 minutes

64 Comet Right Rear Quarter Repair, Part 1

There will be another one coming shortly showing the results of this work so far, that was shot today after doing a lot of sanding with less than ideal materials and tools

See Ya,
Mike

[lavron]

No time to comment right now, but here is Part 2 on the bodywork.

Rear Quarter Repair 2

Running out the door right now will be back later to answer any questions.

See Ya,
Mike

[lavron]

Not a good day for bodywork at all but I got a little done

Rear quarter panel repair 3

Maybe tomorrow will be a better day.

On a good note, I got my new DA Sander today.

See Ya,
Mike

[lavron]

Well it just keeps getting colder, 32-33 today so I wasn't able to do any bodywork, I may bundle up tomorrow and try to work on the front suspension or hide inside depending on how nasty it is tomorrow.

See Ya,
Mike