Power Brakes on '65s - Factory Install?

[kevinshi]

The 1965 Mercury Master Parts Catalog describes Power Brakes as a Kit under Accessories (i.e. not described as original equipment but only as an accessory kit).

Does anyone know for certain whether the factory ever installed the Power Brakes Kit in the 1965s... or was this exclusively a post-assembly (dealer) install?

I speculate that the kit was a post-assembly installation (probably at the dealer). My car had the kit installed (not sure exactly when). As a result, my firewall has two adjoining holes - an upper one used by the original manual brake system and a lower one used by the (add-on) power brake system. The lower hole was necessary because the kit's 9" booster would not fit under the export brace - thus it required a lower hole in the firewall. The power booster kit connected to the same brake pedal by compensating for its lower position with a pushrod that had a higher (offset) receiver hole. Thus the power kit could connect to the same (unmodified) brake pedal pushrod pin.

The firewall had a little dimple at the center of the lower hole. I believe that the dimple was a center for an installer to use a hole saw to cut an additional opening in the firewall. It is possible (likely) that the firewall had this same dimple for the upper hole which would have been used by an assembly worker to cut the upper hole. To wit: I think the firewall was fabricated as a sheet and then a brake hole was cut into that sheet (rather than having the sheet formed with that hole in the first place).

The 9" booster kit used a bracket that served as both a firewall mounting plate and a "cover" to seal over the upper hole.

To my knowledge all after-market booster kits use a 7" booster. Those systems fit just fine into the original upper hole used by the manual brake system. The lower hole would only be cut in the case the car used a 9" booster. When you order an after-market kit you are sometimes asked whether you are doing a manual conversion (upper hole) or replacing an existing power (lower hole) system. The former has a centered pushrod receiver. The latter has a bracket that lowers the booster on the firewall and an elevated (off-center) pushrod receiver.

Not especially important, I am just curious.

Thanks,
kevin

[barrys65cyclone]

you could get power brakes factory installed in 1965, i have sold a couple off parts cars.

[kevinshi]

you could get power brakes factory installed in 1965, i have sold a couple off parts cars.

Thanks Barry!

I think I am correct in asserting that finding the system on a car isn't necessarily definitive evidence that the system was installed by the factory, eh? Those could have been installed by the dealership upon receipt from the factory, eh?

The evidence that might "prove" a system was factory installed would be a car that has a firewall that does not have the upper hole used by manual brakes. By chance do you recall ever seeing a car that had only the lower hole? Another way to express the same question is "have you ever seen a car with a 9"' booster and only one round hole (and not a dual figure 8 hole) for brakes in the firewall?

[poboyjo65]

Comethead Joe's car was factory power brakes & he switched to manual. I remember he had to cut a new hole & weld up his old one. I cant remember if he had pics or not. there is a reinforcement layer of metal on there too .

found this, he mentions having to cut a new hole & weld up the old one,he also mentions they may have different pedal arm/pushrod locations ;
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=14763&p=87673#p87673.

for reference this is what factory manual MC hole looks like.

[comethead]

Not sure if the factory ever installed PB on a 65 Comet but mine had all the correct FoMoCo parts for a stock PB setup. I do remember that the firewall hole for the PB location was rather butchered. Not a clean hole at all.
But that’s not indicative of a dealer install. If I recall correctly some of the holes cut for a factory installed four speed shifter hump were kinda crude too.

Joe

[SASSY]

Not sure if the factory ever installed PB on a 65 Comet but mine had all the correct FoMoCo parts for a stock PB setup. I do remember that the firewall hole for the PB location was rather butchered. Not a clean hole at all.
But that’s not indicative of a dealer install. If I recall correctly some of the holes cut for a factory installed four speed shifter hump were kinda crude too.

Joe

Yep my car was a factory 4speed, slag from torch was evident!

[kevinshi]

I do remember that the firewall hole for the PB location was rather butchered.

Yea, mine certainly is. Which is why I started this thread - just curious to know whether every 9" Booster car has the same gangly "figure 8" dually hole mine has hacked into it.

Pure speculation but I think the 9" booster was never installed during assembly.... but rather every car that had the system had it "added." Perhaps added at the factory after assembly... but still added.